The Conversation – Episode 9 | Sex & The Single Christian Man:

gentleman talking about purity today how do we do it how do we how do we maintain purity just throw it out there for you guys well I think is attainable but you definitely have to know yourself you have to be strong-willed and throw it up to God you’re not going to be able to do that on your own because none of us are that strong yeah yet that’s the interesting point let me I’m I read you guys the scripture real quick and I want to get your thoughts on it I appeal to you therefore brothers by the mercies of God that you present your bodies as a living sacrifice holy acceptable to God which is your spiritual worship do not be conformed to this world but be transformed by the renewal of your mind that by testing you may discern what is the will of God and what is good and acceptable and perfect that’s from Romans so we have this whole dichotomy of the world and our nature so you guys help me out here what’s what does a normal healthy single man look like today and what should a normal healthy single man look like today Alex what do you think man so is it is are we talking about a saved this is a saved I believe in Jesus yeah so yes let’s go with that angle all right sure I think that I should he look like what should he look like as much like Christ as possible okay I think that nobody’s going to have a everybody’s normal is different so you know you can’t say well the reasons Bible in the morning and then before another five hours he reaches Bible again I think that it’s not so much a list of actions and like like a checklist as it is where its heart is okay I think the focus should be his heart and his desire is to get closer to God and please God and what he thinks what he wears what he does his actions and I think that a changed heart emanates to every other part of your life instead of creating this you know bucket list of what it takes to be pure I think it comes down to having a heart that’s willing to die to self to live for God okay Roman what do you think what is it what should a normal single Christian man Christian look like a healthy I think the same exam he should look like Christ okay he should and keep pursuing to be like Christ so keep dying to self keep denying yourself those desires that you previously wanted when you were unsaved and you still have those you have to fight those off and just keep pursuing Christ okay so you said we have those desires with the final mall so and culture our culture has a different take on what a normal healthy single man should look like what does culture or what are you guys that what do whatever you seen that culture dictates of what is normal culture wants you to embrace those desires and just have at it yeah be happy yeah make yourself happy just do whatever right anybody else had their own personal experience of what culture is telling you is normal for you but you’ve had to fight to do to basically be abnormal so to speak I mean I think I think for a Christian I think it’s important right just practically someone that balances their responsibilities and controls their desires um I think when it comes to like you know outside of Christian culture I’m controlling your desires is the thing that’s like the least one of the least most least prioritize things in this world because if anything we’re not supposed to control our desires were supposed to give in to that and so in our culture it’s just it’s really easy to do that yeah and it’s almost encouraged to do that whereas as a Christian as believers we have to really go against the grain of that just because just like he said I’m just believing in God as a choice purity itself is a choice yeah and so it’s something that is habitual of something that needs me practice yeah yeah I think on that same note I think the the natural man wants to be seen as strong and this is perception this idea that if I do what I want if I take what I want if I feel it and go do it then that makes me a strong person this idea of manliness or strength is the ability to get what you want yeah when you want it but I think that’s the opposite man I think being a slave to whatever you feel whatever you feel it actually doesn’t take nearly as much strength and it takes to tell yourself no right and to man up in that way and it’s really it’s really childish when you think about it you know it’s really an immature approach to masculinity right when you just when you all you do is follow your instinct and your nature basically because what kids do that’s what children do they feel it they want it they do it yeah and then when they can’t do it they have a fit they have throw tantrums and all such thing and that’s kind of what culture does if you guys would agree culture kind of paints this picture of men as these eternal adolescents you know who are constantly you know playing video games all day long or you know have never never had the desire to grow up and to actually deal with their sexuality in a mature way meaning instead of just feeding it kind of like you’re saying Alex you put in measures you put things in place to kind of to protect it you don’t mean nothing a lot of that has to do with the condition of our heart right like you were like you were saying so what basic what is the condition of our hearts that causes us to be kind of to feed into what culture saying we are yeah I think what causes it is not to view a woman or even Vee yourself through the eyes of God I think when we take an approach of I want it when I want it I want it now and not seeing the world like God will see the world that’ll put us into some difficult situations definitely when it comes to women we can view them as objectives and view them as something lesser than what they are it’s very easy for us to give in and for our heart to not be in that right place so I think if we just look at the world and especially view women through the eyes of God that’s very telling on where your heart is at what does that mean to you when you say whew a woman through the eyes of God what does we’ll treat her I think in the right respect where you’re not objectifying her you’re not you know undressing her with your eyes you’re holding her up to her highest height and you know it’s going back to where we’re saying like at God like you know every day we’re going to try to be as him and he wouldn’t look at her like that and we understand we have urges we’re going to miss the mark at times but to kind of always have that viewpoint of the world and especially women I think that’s a telling part on you know where that heart is that yeah I have a question and I hear what you say that and I agree I think that when you say like let be like Christ there’s this immediate mentality of well he’s God so that’s unattainable but he wouldn’t have access to do it if we couldn’t do it right so I want to just undergird that but I have a question man because I really want to make sure this is as applicable as possible so say you go to your friend invites you to church you walk into the Welcome Center or whatever and I don’t know the choir member bad choir members beautiful this is a beautiful woman can I acknowledge her beauty and not lust or in that moment what is the person supposed to do when they when you tell them you look at her like God like should I get a bird’s-eye view look down Mike whatever look like in that moment is it the avoidance of her aspects or is it a mental thing like what do I do in that moment that’s a good question everybody should answer that karna Karnas what do you think um I think is important in that situation to really exercise wisdom I mean I if if there’s a because if bad girls in church let’s just be real you know what I mean like this bad girl right and so on but in those situations don’t ma’am I is very I mean you know women are really taught to like really guard their hearts you know what I mean and so with that man and knowing that that scripture man you really have to lie approach that with like really sensitivity you know what I mean so you can just go to buy yo girl you bad you don’t know me like you just have to like you know hey acknowledge something if you’re going to another something acknowledge something that doesn’t make them feel like they’re attacked it doesn’t make them feel like they’re too mean – so you’re saying is it’s okay to go ahead and acknowledge the fact that she’s a beautiful woman yet to express that to her I mean I think so I mean I think as long as it’s done with wisdom and his lungs is done intentionally with with the right heart behind okay me does anybody think differently I know I agree look okay so how would you how would you approach it Romans it’s not bad to think somebody’s pretty or beautiful whatever it’s not to think somebody’s attractive but it’s not bad right but when you take it to that next level yeah and think lustful thoughts that’s when it becomes simple yeah right yeah that’s in the lustful thoughts and let’s be honest there in us okay it’s in our nature we’re fallen we’re sinful that comes right but Galatians five is a good scripture to refer to at this point because there’s fruits of the spirit as well we’ve got from the power of the holy spirit that lives in us gives us gives us the ability it’s not in ourselves that we have the ability to ward off the lustful thoughts and things like that but it gives us self-control wonderful spirit fruits of the Spirit is self-control you know so that means we’re able to tap into that thing when our when our flesh rises up and says mmm we can go back and say hold on I got the Spirit of Christ living in me therefore I don’t have to yield to my fleshly desires I don’t have to be you know subject to that I can say I can rise above it and keep it keep it pushing and keep it holy but that is a challenge for a lot of a lot of Christians and when we get into dating situations the challenge intensifies because now we’re kind of doing this one on one thing and then we get kind of iffy with the line of where do we is what’s too much basically what’s too far how do we maintain our purity but still express to each other that we like each other and we care for each other and you know how do we do that you know so there’s a there’s a line somewhere in there says that’s too far what’s that line for some people it’s kissing for some people without you first off I think instead of thinking uh how close can we get to that line whatever it is mhm it should be how far away from that line can we get mm-hmm and just stay safe stay honor and gone right staying pure yeah because the closer you get to it it’s gonna get it’s sketchy sketchy yeah yeah people get hurt right at the end of the day you just need a view opposite-sex as your brother and sister in Christ yeah because you really don’t know if you’re going to marry that person when you’re dating them maybe so you need to treat them as a brother and sister in Christ in case it doesn’t because if you’re at church and you you cross boundaries it’s gonna be weird right it’s gonna be awkward and you don’t want that with your sister in Christ right yeah I think man like especially other lines where Roman said about the line I think before you even make the list for the line I’m a heart news I’m always go back to the heart right like being very clear are your intentions with each other um so you meet the young lady you guys exchanged numbers whatever the case and the next step is we need to have a conversation mm-hmm shut up right we didn’t talk because we need to sit and go okay listen this is where I’m at where are you so I think that it’s important to go in relationships like brother and sister and go what does that mean how do I do that is still you know show affection I think the word is hospitality right let’s you want to go and spend time with this person especially as the man who wants to lead out you just be hospitable be caring be present be there but the second in your thoughts and your intentions it starts being about how she can ultimately serve you me I think that’s when it messes up when I’m opening the door because I want you to think I’m nice because I want to kiss up tonight mmm isn’t when I say you look nice because I want you to think nice things in me because I want you to copy me too when when your actions become self-serving yeah that’s when that heart comes out and when the relationship dating even friendships is you’re friends with somebody and your intentions aren’t pure then you’re really serving yourself I think that’s when we have you honest with ourselves and and I did do a hard stop and then having that heart helps with that line like me and my mom who’s my wife now we couldn’t talk after 11 o’clock yeah it was not good I’m saying my back got slippery I’ll backslide when I’m Sam yeah mine are you talking to my team I be texting right in detective because the emoticons listen me more calm but I gotta go you get like the Bible says um it encourages men not to make women burn not to light a fire you right and the word used there it’s not even talking about touching right it sounds a lot like an emotional so men like we never we doing sometimes we know we know what that text means right so let me ask you this is this a subjective thing like it’s different for each individual or would you guys say no heavy petting period when you’re dating or no kissing whatsoever you know when you’re dating what what where what’s that line is clear no matter what your spiritual maturity level is do not cross it for you guys for you personally what would you say is too much where is it it’s talking on the phone late that’s just way too much or is it you know going on alone with no with no accountability that’s just way too much no not necessarily I guess if you kiss too long watches long yeah yeah that’s a lot of people overlook that but that’s that’s a real thing you know you a kiss on the cheek is different from embrace type kiss I think it’s different at different times to like say I have to give Hilary a ride home sometimes respect Hillary like just go inside just go like we’ll pray and then just go like I don’t want to even get close to anything and she she understands she knows because you guys are on the same page right yeah I want to top on the point that you made – and this is for everyone as well you said your situation where the person you’re dating understands your boundary she understands the mindset behind it yeah have you guys encountered situations where you’re trying to maintain your purity and you hold it up here and then you have someone you’re dating who’s trying to maintain their purity but they hold it kind of right here so they’re willing to do things that you aren’t necessarily cool with do you succumb to those things because they’re not necessarily violations of Scripture but they’re below your standard and you like this young lady so you want to keep her in your life how do you handle situations like that or have you found yourself in a situation like that I mean in those situations I think it’s really important in any relationship for anybody that you’re even courting for the man to set the boundary okay um we when the woman sets the boundaries and a man doesn’t really have those he’s really kind of on on like on almost autopilot attack mode you know what I mean he’s gonna see how far he’s gonna push your boundaries he’s gonna see how far is that elastic you know in the mirror is that like really hardwired but when a man says when a man really sets those boundaries and it really is a case-by-case basis I don’t think it’s like one thing that you can do cuz some people they don’t struggle with kiss and other people you kiss me I want to have sex with you right now and only I think it’s different for different people um but if if we try and say if those boundaries aren’t set by the person that’s leading the relationship then they are bound to crack they’re bound to get pushed back yeah I’m gonna be super honest please so like in my immaturity man I would always let the girls hit the boundaries like all through high school but before I got there but okay well coz but I would do it in like the most conniving evil sinful way cuz I would try to sound like like I care and I want to be sensitive to how comfortable you are so you let me know how how far we can go in but what I was really saying is tell me your defensive strategy so I could do a QB sneak right let me know what you have plans so I know what daughter not me um so it really goes back to the intention of a man like like me me and my wife now we just have to acknowledge there’s certain atmospheres we can’t be in like there’s no reason why the door should be closed right there’s the reason why you know this type of music should be playing at this hour like we have to just start being really real about what’s happening you know it doesn’t snow in LA because there’s no atmosphere for that yeah if you stay in places where the atmosphere isn’t conducive to sin mm-hmm then it’s much harder to do it yeah and I think that when it when comes to when I was saving and now I’m meeting ladies and I’m trying to talk with people then I compromised so much to try to fill this void in myself man and I think that it’s so important that you know it’s all men at the table now right because we we as the mid we have to leave the relationships we should be setting those boundaries and at a lot of cases the women are looking for that from us they’re looking for us to lead in that way and where you may think how she won’t write me or she’ll think this it’ll actually set a standard and she’ll probably be more impressed with you if you can make a standard and keep it then succumbing the hardest to please oh yeah that’s that’s a really really good point because I think a lot of men we we kind of shy away from setting that standard because we’re kind of fearful of losing losing out losing the woman that we really care about right but chances are if we hold that line even when she pushes against it and fights us on it I mean that’s that’s a sign for us like oh are you sure you’re the one I don’t know I gotta push hard that we were the same page here but even if you if she does push against that standard and we up we uphold it we’ve become more attractive even though if we don’t we don’t see it that way he wound up becoming more attractive so we talked about boundaries and I want to end on this point what are some practical things you guys that we can put into place to to protect ourselves basically and to protect our purity to hold our purity and a high standard that’s basically what we’re doing is I think somebody brought up the point it’s not what we’re you know keeping ourselves from but what we’re leaning toward we’re leaning toward a high standard and holding our purity high so what are some things we can do to make sure that we keep that standard high you know so like for example I had my wife we did not have a high standard whatsoever okay it wasn’t it was not hot we talked like we had a high standard but we did not have a high standard because I didn’t mind going over to her apartment late at night okay Kristen okay I didn’t mind she didn’t mind coming over to my house didn’t mind but that not having that high standard and opened the door for all kind of foolishness some stuff we avoid it because God is gracious some stuff we didn’t avoid man because we’re sin so there are there are things that she and I could have done too and we’re going to teach those things to our daughters that we could have made if I messed up I want you to make the same mistakes I missed that for a reason for somebody to learn something um but there are things that we’re going to teach our daughters and I want to know what you guys think what are you guys going to teach your kids or what are you going to teach yourselves a single man to do to stay in sustain your right leg yeah I think you have to stay focused and stay faithful stay busy you know I feel that you know a lot of times when you don’t have anything to do when I have a plan you get yourself in trouble that’s an important point staying busy okay stand busy busy doing what and for me I like to work out okay so I so I stay in the gym and I I’m a big Fitness guy so it’s not just necessarily pumping iron but eating right and making sure my mental health is this healthy as my physical health so that could be reading books spending time with friends my sister just keeping my mind body and soul on the right things verses and I wonder what I’m going to do today and then going through Instagram and then you know you catch yourself slipping in somebody’s DM titled up right exactly Roman I was going to say I’m all for like don’t do this don’t do this don’t do this but at the end at the end of the day how much do you really love Christ because if Jesus died for you you can’t mess with things that put him up on the cross Hey I think that’s quote from Spurgeon chapter Spurgeon already satisfied but it’s true if you’re always focused on don’t drink this water don’t drink this don’t touch this cup don’t touch this that’s all focus on I’m gonna fall but if you’re focused on Christ and serving Christ loving Christ focused on the gospel what you did for you it’s gonna be harder to sin yeah yeah good point a lot of the stuff that were saying right now I was like really cool for like believers yes like stuff did you know purity is a concept I believe get you know cast that around the world they don’t really get the concept of parody they don’t even really want the concept of purity so like even right now I would probably say that I’m more in the world right now then I’m in Christ okay and in what I mean by that is purity at one point for me was really really important um for me right now is a huge struggle as a Christian you don’t want to compromise the gospel and you don’t want to compromise the the view of you know how Christ is perceived the people who have a desire from the God needs to work on to get them there so in any Christ some things that you could put in place is it’s really accountability it’s really having those go-to people to like yell like I’m struggle with this right now keep coming through you know what I mean that’s that’s huge if you’re not in Christ then it really comes down to changing what you want and you know what I mean like at the end of the day like if you’re in the world man like you’re you have a dip like like a side chick because you’re really trying to fill the void you know what I mean you’re trying to fill something that’s not there right and so it’s really not it’s really acknowledging that void and saying do I really want this or do I want something better right and I think in Christ I think the commonality between the two is you have to want something better something better and you have to really change like you know what it is that you desire so yeah you know I wanted to just quickly tap on the whole desire conversation just really quickly guys we have an appetite for sin periods built in okay but the appetite grows when we feed it you know I mean so just kind of throw this out there if if pornography is a struggle well lust is a struggle you don’t feed yourself pornography you know what I mean if you know less is a struggle for yourself you don’t you don’t feast on pornography and then expect to not desire to actually follow through and then have sex with someone you know and if even even musically if if we know lust is an issue we know we have the desire to have sex and we listen to music and songs about sex all day long and that’s our appetite guess what we’re going to fulfill it you know at some point we’re going to fulfill it because it becomes normative for us it’s what we’re feasting on it’s our thought pattern it’s our it’s our sight pattern and so it’s it’s the normal thing to do is to fall into it if we if we tell ourselves we go on a diet and say I’m going to eat right spiritually I’m going to eat right I’m not going to feed my sin I’m not going to feed my lust and I’m going to actually going to starve it it doesn’t go away the desired lust doesn’t go away but it starts to diminish usually right so Alex for you what what are some things you can you you were practically put in place even even when you’re dating to keep yourself in your relationship you know the height the standard viewer I mean similar to Roman Roman man I think that of course says it ended up being a list of things we do and do not do but just because of the the leadership I have in my church and the people I’ve around me my list of dudes were way longer than my list of don’t yeah I think that a lot of folks new Christian or not but see Christianity religion as just a list of stuff not to do right and as a result of which they associated with losing out on missing out on things when in actuality it’s the only thing that fulfills it’s the only thing that brings you real joy so instead of man because my wife now having you know we can’t do this we can’t we said okay when we hang out we pray before we hang out and then we always eat in public and then we always you know watch a movie to add some substance so we always you know say something nice to each other about a week and we always are honest with each other so I think having more dues will keep you from the don’ts because you don’t want to have people just in like this glass house where they show like you know if I act on anything I might break and fall and then I think you only get the dues from this idea of I mean just stopping these things is not going to where you can’t just go cold turkey in the sense that the desires will always be that about this is a war going on inside you the biggest turning point in me is when I had a mentor tell me I like you know this is working on the side I said yeah I know flesh versus periodic he said in a war you fight you you seek to harm and I see you okay cool Lisa Alex if you’re not intentionally fighting against your flesh you’re fighting someone else and your actions and your words will hurt someone else you’re at war with probably possibly the people who are the closest to you inadvertently and I sat down and looked at my the people around me and looked at how much I have scarred people around me because I wouldn’t fight the right enemy yeah so I think that it’s about being honest with yourself about finding more things to do that that are glorifying to God better fun that’s just like you know bottle setting every single night but that are fun right there’s so much to do in the world makes you think that there’s nothing to do other than have sex but there’s tons of things to do right are you saying Bible study isn’t fun I’m saying about the studies that’s what you just said table setting is awesome but I’m saying that the Bible is the only book you can take it to a mountain for five years and memorize and come down and not be any better a Christian mm-hm all of the Bible 98% of it has to be acted out with somebody else so Marvel said is great but eventually you got to go do it right or else Bible studies for nothing indeed gentlemen it’s a pleasure having you guys here on the conversation thank you guys for coming and can thank you guys for watching you